'This is England' - Stephen Graham Q&A

The 'Snatch' star discusses playing a racist skinhead in Shane Meadows' devastating new film.

Apr 26 2007

Stephen Graham made a name for himself playing craft cockney Tommy in Guy Ritchie's 'Snatch'. Since then he has starred in the likes of 'Band of Brothers', 'Gangs of New York' and 'Goal!', and this week he delivers his finest performance yet, playing racist skinhead Combo in Shane Meadows' 'This is England'. Chris Tilly caught up with him to discuss playing such a dark character.

Why do you think the film is having such a powerful effect on the people who have seen it?

I think it's because you go on this complete journey with this young lad – you're taken with him on this rollercoaster ride. It starts off with him being bullied at school and then we go on this lovely journey. I think it reminds us of what we were all like at that age. Like if you were with a group – not so much a gang – but with a group of mates and it was just the fun of being a teenager. Do you know what I mean? Your first kiss and your first little grope of a chick, having the odd drink with your mates and stuff like that. Nothing too serious, you know, all kind of playful. I think because little Tommo [Thomas Turgoose, who plays Shaun in the film] captivates the audience so much straight away, you're just with him – you go through everything with him. When my character Combo comes out of prison the film changes, which is common to a lot of Shane's films, but what we set out to do was to present him like no other skinhead that we've seen really. Not just someone who goes around kicking people's heads in and all that, but the audience has some empathy for him and some sympathy for him, which I think we managed to pull off. I think it's that kind of tiny glimmer of hope that you've got for Combo, and then it's just taken away. I think that's it. It just makes you think a lot about how things have changed over the last twenty years. It's like a parallel to what's happening now – like a mirror image with the war and stuff. And there's still kids being killed for the colour of their skin today.

So what are your memories of that era?

Well, I was a break dancer. It was the eighties and I was into Grandmaster Flash and people like that. In 1983 I would have been nine and my memories are just great, I loved the eighties, I thought they were fantastic. Summer holidays were just amazing, you'd pack a bag of sandwiches, jam butties and couple of bottles of milk or water and get on your BMX and that was it, we were gone till like six o'clock at night. We just had so much fun, we used to go egging, collecting bird eggs from trees. For me the eighties were great. And so much of that is at the beginning of the film. We weren't a skinhead gang or nothing but my dad was a mod himself, a bit of a two-tone boy. I'm mixed race and my dad was into The Specials and stuff like that.

Did growing up mixed race help inform your performance as a racist?

I don't know if it helped me perform, I think it just gave me a different insight into it. If I'd been totally Caucasian I would still have been able to give the same performance. It's not a major thing, it's just normal for me, it's my life, it's what I am. I think it did help slightly with the final scene and the way I got on with Andrew Shim. We still have a really close relationship, but that final scene is more about Combo wishing for what he could have had and realising that someone else had that. If his dad hadn't just fucked off and left him and his mum and his little sister when he was a kid maybe he wouldn't have been in and out of homes and in and out of care. It's more a sense of Combo being a product of society – in and out of care homes, into borstal and stuff when he was fifteen. The way Shane works is he creates a whole back story. You come up with a biography, and we spent a whole week creating that for every single character involved in the film. You had to sit in a chair in the middle of the room and get asked questions by everyone, so you know your character inside out and back to front.

Is that the bulk of the preparation for a role like this?

It's that creating a back story for yourself. As an actor, it's a lovely way to work. Then, when we're doing that Milky scene, Combo's thinking about when his dad left him and what life was like on his own, in and out of foster care – when you do that amount of preparation, nothing you do can be wrong. Alright, it might be not particularly right for the film but that's the genius of Shane.

So even if it wasn't right for the film, it was right for the character?

Exactly, right for the character. Because for some of the scenes we'd shoot for ten or fifteen minutes, and then it comes down. With the group and stuff, if someone comes up with a nice idea or an improvisation, Shane will pursue that and see where it goes. His genius comes back into it when he's editing. I think it took him a year to edit the film. So out of that ten-fifteen minute film he might only use, I don't know, two or three minutes of it. Two minutes of gold within that scene, you know what I mean? For an actor it's a beautiful way to work.

The performances do seem to give the film a documentary-like feel.

Yeah, so real. When I first watched it as a viewer in Italy, I was completely blown away by the performances of everyone who I'd been working with, and there are moments when it seems like a documentary to me too.

Did you ever come into contact with skinheads as you were growing up?

There was one at school who was a bit of a skinhead – he was alright though, he wasn't too bad. Oddly enough it was this other lad that was the bully at school. This fellow with big long hair, who was a bit of a goth. He was the bully. But this skinhead was dead sound. There were older ones that used to smoke weed near the shops when we played football round the back but they were harmless. They were really nice actually.

The film does seem to encourage the viewer not to judge people from their appearance.

That opening – the gang at the beginning – I'd be in that gang tomorrow if I was a kid. I'd love to have been knocking about the streets with them. I love the way they're in it for the music, and the clothes – it's lovely that. That first gang is lovely. It's Combo that comes along and completely demolishes it.

Was it difficult to shoot that violent scene at the end of the film?

To be honest with you it wasn't really that tough. I mean, that one at the end, that Milky scene took about three days to shoot, that was quite difficult. But when I'm in it, I'm in it, but as soon as they say cut I'll go and make a cup of tea or have a little game of footie or play on the Playstation. I can't be arsed with all this fucking 'let's take the work home' – imagine me taking that character home. I've got two kids and a missus; I would have been horrible to live with! I just don't see the point – I think that's quite pretentious and wanky. I know it works for some people, I've worked with some people like that, and they should speak for themselves, but it's not for me. Especially with the subject, because Tommo's only young, I think he was like thirteen when we made it, so you have to make it fun for him. That scene at the end though, when we finished, the whole crew, and I mean big fucking macho manly sparkies and electricians and lorry drivers and the like – they were all crying, because I think we felt how important it was. You know, even if it wasn't going to make a big major difference, just at that moment, after the three days we'd all been through together, we all felt a part of something. It was a surreal experience for me, because it felt like everyone was with you in that room, trying to make it right for you and support you all the way through.

Can I talk a little bit about Tommo as it's such an amazing performance from someone so young?

Personally I've never seen anything like that apart from 'Kes'. Tommo's performance was just… it was like working with Robert De Niro. Honestly, because you'd do something, and the way Shane works is it's all improvised, so you've got a rough idea of what you're going to do or where you're going to go in a scene, but it's up to us to create it, so if I'd say something and he'd just sort of look at me and go 'What's that? What you doing?' and I'd be like, 'Fucking hell – okay then, THAT doesn't work!' He kept me on my toes all the time. He's such a lovely lad as well.

I remember, not long after I watched 'Dead Man's Shoes', I interviewed Paddy Considine, and this doesn't reflect very well on me, but I was actually a little bit scared of him because of that film. Have you found people's reactions changing towards you after they've seen the film?

There was an American couple that must have watched the film at the London Film Festival, and I was talking to someone and they were looking a little bit scared of me. I just turned round and looked at them and said, 'did you enjoy the film?' and they were like, 'yeah – yeah' and I was like, 'that's nice, thanks for coming', and they were like, 'we thought you'd be really evil'. No, I'm not, I'm a father of two, I'm a nice guy! I'm a little bit of a scally but I'm alright, you know what I mean? But we'll see how things change when it comes out in the cinemas. Hope I won't get big burly dickheads wanting to fight me in the pub for nothing!

And do you think people will realise you're a Scouser now rather than the cockney you played in 'Snatch'?

I always get that one – [cockney accent] 'thought you were from fucking London boy'. I'm lucky I can do accents. I've played Irish and all sorts, so it was really nice to play a Scouser this time. Shane's also said that he's planning on putting me and Paddy together in something, which would be really nice, maybe late in the summer or towards the end of the year. I'd love to do that.

'This is England' is released on Friday.

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