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Jesse Schenker at the Gander
Photograph: Rayon RichardsJesse Schenker at the Gander

Jesse Schenker interview: ‘Playing with food has always been my natural Xanax’

The masterful chef behind Recette and the Gander opens up about the troubled years before success

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Anyone interested in the culinary scene knows of Jesse Schenker's accomplishments: two successful restaurants (Recette and The Gander), two New York Times stars, James Beard Award nominations and an Iron Chef win. But he also has a bleaker, lesser-known story: From 12 to 21, Schenker struggled through drug addiction, the depths of which he recounts in his new memoir, All or Nothing: One Chef's Appetite for the Extreme. A difficult story to tell, certainly, but also to read as we journey down the rabbit hole with the renowned chef, from his restless youth to discovering crack and heroin to a period of homelessness and, finally, the arrest that saved him.

I caught up with Schenker by phone to talk about his book, his devotion to cooking-even in the worst of times-and, of course, his dream dinner party.

What made you decide to share the story of your struggles?

For a few years now, my close family and friends have always been encouraging me to write a book or tell my story, to give hope to other addicts or other people. It's important for me to give back, and, you know, there's a saying in AA, "You can't keep what you have unless you give it away." And for me, to be able to get clean at 21 after everything I'd been through, it's really a miracle. That in itself was a story to tell, and then moving to New York, opening a restaurant at 27, getting two stars in the Times, opening another restaurant, it was kind of like...That's an interesting story, too. I wanted to show people that hard work and dedication can make a difference and that if you're suffering from addiction or someone you know is, there's hope. It doesn't have to be so bad. You don't have to go to the deep places and dark places that I did.

It definitely was a decision that I discussed with my wife. Like, my kids will read it one day, but by the time they're old enough to read it, they're gonna know who I am. I'm really not ashamed of anything. I have no regrets, I'm happy with my life now. Again, I keep going back to...There's so many people suffering out there. So many people on the precipice who are too fearful of making the next step or making a jump, or there's families that are just too afraid to let their children go-they're enabling them. Someone can read this, and if it helps somebody, then I did a great thing.

What was the process of writing a book like for you, coming from an entirely different world and creative medium?

I started taping my story, having no intention of writing a book or turning into anything or selling it. It was very cathartic for me. Through [a doctor] I met my book agent. She wanted to do a cookbook, but when I showed her some of my manuscripts, she went, "Whoa! This is so much more. Would you mind if I sent this to some editors?" And I said, "Sure, it can't hurt. I have no idea what I'm going to do, if I'm going to sell it." It was very organic. I met with a few publishers. And Mark Chait, from HarperCollins, he was the best. He said, "Your story's great, very inspirational. Just write it." I got the book deal and within like 6 months, turned the book in. It was probably a thousand hours of recording that was transcribed.

One thing that really struck me, reading the story, is how suddenly the decision came to you to choose family over drugs. It almost seemed like an epiphany.

It sort of was. I just hit such a hard bottom so quickly. But every time I thought, like, "This is the end," a trap door would come out, and it would just get worse. For me, the pain and the discomfort were so strong. They wiped out any sort of euphoria, any sort of excitement to want to use drugs. It all stopped. I remember waking up in that motel room after that crazy weekend in Orlando and feeling so demoralized. I thought, "I'm wanted by the cops. Nobody wants to have anything to do with me. I'm dope-sick. I'm shivering. I'm gonna have to wake up now and have to hustle and steal and lie. I don't want this anymore. This isn't worth it." And I remember, I got down on my knees and cried. And I called my parents, and my mom hung up on me. And my dad told me to go to Broward General, and then he hung up on me. And I remember, something struck me. I cried out, "God help me," not knowing who God was or what that meant. Within 48 hours my prayers were answered, and I got arrested. And there was just this giddiness, like something had lined up.

And then you actually detoxed in jail.

Yeah, thank God I was incarcerated for six months. The drug drain and the intensity of the cravings, they were there. The physical withdrawal took a few weeks and then the mental cravings...if I weren't in jail at that time, I definitely would have relapsed. So because I was in jail, I feel like it all worked out. And I didn't have anything to prove to anyone anymore; I didn't have to lie to anyone. I remember when they said, "Jesse Schenker, pack up your stuff." I didn't want to leave jail. I was afraid. So, yeah, call it an epiphany, something just aligned at that time. It was like God or my higher power taking me by the head and just slamming me face-first into the cement, saying "Wake up, wake up, wake up, when are you gonna get this?" And I think finally something just clicked with me. I knew I would either go to prison for a long time for a major crime, or I was going to end up dying.

But you didn't. You found another path.

Playing with food has always been my natural Xanax. So getting a taste of cooking again, like making the mashed potatoes in jail and working that grill at lunch on my work release-I just ran with it. That same drive, that same intensity that got me up every morning to do drugs, I put that into cooking. The euphoria I get from that is great. Watching people smile when you make them something to eat...it's crazy.

The trajectory of the book seems to go from trying to evade reality to trying, daily, to remain in and appreciate the present-which is often difficult, for everyone. What do you do to try to bring yourself back to the present moment?

Good question. It is definitely something that anyone can relate to. Ultimately for me, I try to have a gratitude list. It's very easy to get caught up in the daily grind. The refrigerator's down, the pay checks aren't here, this guy's unhappy or your son's late for school. There's so many things. Life, it's all-consuming. There's just moments when I try to be with myself. I take a breath and look at what I have and just bring it back to: "I can't believe I'm standing here. Where I was and where I am now, I'm so grateful. If everything stopped right now, if this is the end, if this is all I ever have-my son, my daughter and my wife and cooking-that's more than I could ever ask for." And it grounds me. Being with my children especially. Time slows to a crawl. It's not a cliché. It's the truth. Sundays I spend with my kids and my wife; the days go by, and I feel like I'm a teenager again. Today, I wake up, I go to work, the next thing I know, it's already September. It just shows you, when you're older, you're either looking back, at where you messed up, or looking forward at what you want. Shitting on the moment. If you're really able to stay in the moment and enjoy what you have, time comes to a crawl. Unfortunately, the lifestyle that I chose, I always have to be working. If it's the middle of the day, I have to walk outside, look through the restaurant windows, and see what my wife and I created. That helps. Being mindful. I'm just trying to be mindful. I sure have not mastered that.

Any New York restaurant recommendations you'd like to share?

Yeah...I like L'Artusi; I know that gets a lot of love already. I'm really very much looking forward to the cookbook that Gabe and Katherine Thompson and Joey Campanale are putting out. Downtown Italian. I think it comes out in October. [ed. note: It does.]

5 people to have dinner with you: who would you invite?

Eddie Vedder. Bob Dylan. Obama. My wife. And Maynard James Keenan.

Would you cook?

Sure. I would make espressos for everybody and probably grilled cheese with bacon and French fries.

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Jesse Schenker: All or Nothing
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Schenker, 31, owns two successful Manhattan restaurants, Recette and the Gander, has won an Iron Chef battle and is a James Beard Foundation Award nominee. But he also possesses a dark past of drug addiction, theft and jail time, which he opens up about for the first time in his new memoir. Catch the chef as he recounts how he learned to stop evading reality and embrace the present moment.

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